Eli

We're feeling silly on the pod today. But that's all good. We have our first guests of the year the Dewy Dudes, Evan and Emilio. I really enjoyed the conversation as a skincare novice, I suppose. Lots to talk about including who and what constitutes a Dewy Dude. But before we get there, I know this is Trey. It's been it's been in the tabs. It's been in the news cycle the Sephora tweens the Drunk Elephant. Yeah, there's I don't even know Gen Alphas. There's a lot of skincare stuff in the news. Before we kick it over to the interview.

Trey

Well, I think young people are getting younger and younger.

Eli

Evolutionary.

Trey

If you if you've been in Sephora lately, you may notice a small five year old, begging crying their parents to get them the new Sol de Janeiro skincare or a Drunk Elephant. I'm just naming brands, but essentially there's all these brands on Tik Tok. And I saw one girl in particular, who her mom was like, recording her for a Tik Tok and she's like, breaking down. Like, I saw these girls on Tik Tok had the new Sol de Janeiro and the new Drunk Elephant and I wanted so badly. And basically, it's prompted all of this discourse because there's girls, you know, aged five to nine. I don't think any younger yet, but we'll see. Doing these Get Ready With Me videos on TikTok using these products that feature like vitamin C serums. Retinol. So you know, Cabbage Patch Kids have been replaced by by like, expensive skincare that runs anywhere from like $30 to $90 in some cases, which I don't know about you, but these children those allowances are really.

Eli

Yeah, I mean, I'm not a regular at Sephora. However, I think my takeaway from this is that maybe you take away the phones, maybe take away the iPads. Back in my day, you would get a third degree burn from going down the slide on a sunny day, you know, scrape your knees a little bit your mom would get mad at you for you know, I just bought you those shorts and now now they're ruined. Right? And now you have you know, kids and elbowing you in the Sephora line?

Trey

Well, yeah, I think maybe you know, young children have always wanted to be older you always kind of idolized like the older brother, older sister. But now with every child having an iPad in their stroller, obviously they're looking up to these like 14 year olds who are wearing this you know, suite of products are getting at Sephora with these like allowances that I don't know where they're coming from. Parents are not cracking down.

Clara

I guess I was gonna say this was a mini discourse in what was it like around Christmas because all of these moms were posting on social media like look what's on my kids Christmas wish list and it was like drunk elephant products. It was like Chanel keychain. And I think there is like a very disturbing like, I don't know level to which nine and 10 year olds are like acquainted with all these things like infrared face masks and like red light therapy at a very young and impressionable age and I personally think it's strange that they're being indulged to this degree.

Trey

But we had a lot of really interesting conversations with our two guests.

Eli

Evan and Emilio.

Trey

Secifically around how skincare beauty the industry is expanding to include men how they are kind of, you know, dissecting skincare and all of its myths for men how men can kind of get more into things like skincare beauty makeup, I don't think it's what makeup but like there's a lot of interesting things there that are still going on where middle America as we discussed like still probably can't comprehend the idea of a moisturized skin barrier.

Clara

They've never seen a moisturize male barrier before and they need to see it.

Eli

Hold up king this isn't for you yet. Yeah.

Clara

Anyway.

Trey

Did you guys I really find it fascinating. I kind of learned some stuff.

Eli

I mean you are definitely right on in there in the convo Trey.

Trey

Well, I'm, yeah.

Eli

It's just right up your alley.

Trey

I'm deep in the Sephora isles elbowing children.

Eli

Yeah, no, I learned I learned a lot. I thought I thought the like the language of how you might market to the Dewy Dude as a marketer, I suppose was interesting specifically. Yeah. Like how brands are speaking to like younger, younger kids, tweens whatever. Like the Hey King marketing, right?

Clara

I also thought it was interesting and you'll have to listen for more. But talking about the Dewy Dude and how skincare is starting to fit into more of like a luxury lifestyle lane for men but I think going back to the Gen Alpha conversation. I think in all seriousness, it kind of has to do with that, I think in the large part in terms of the appeal to like a Gen Alpha kid, like, I think the price point of a drunk elephant product is insane. But I think that it allows them to participate in what they feel like is like a very grown up and luxury experience for something that is like, cheaper than say, I don't know, a Chanel bag, but also isn't as like location specific as an Erawan smoothie, but it's like, oh, I have the same moisturizer as Hailey Bieber or whatever, right? Obviously, for men and like the value judgment or whatever is slightly different. But I think that it kind of is similar underlying insight between both of those rising skincare demos, shall I say, but I also found it interesting as the lone, you know, as the female minority of the male skincare conversation.

Trey

And the very real you know, Gen Z Gen Alpha will never be able to afford a home so like, what are they going to spend their you know, disposable income on drunk elephant?

Clara Malley

Moisturize and paying rent forever.

Trey

Yeah.

Eli

All right. Should we tap them in? Let's do it. All right Day One FM. Evan and Emilio, otherwise known as the Dewy Dudes. Welcome to the pod and great to have you on.

Evan

Thanks for having us.

Emilio

Can't say it any better than that.

Eli

That is thesound of somebody who treked through sleet and snow on a Tuesday in January.

Trey

I was hoping that dewy dewy dewy song on our pod somehow. Like we need you guys to produce our

Emilio

Yeah, it's so funny that it sounds like I mean, we chose it cuz it sounds like it's saying Dewy. Dewy, but it's actually saying gooey. Yeah. Oh, is it? You heard it here first.

Eli

I thought it was from, do you remember? This is like 2013 There's like a South African duo? Yeah. Sounds like that. I don't know. I mean,

Evan

It does sound like what's her name? It's like. Yeah, it does sound like Yolandi.

Eli

I think she was canceled. Yeah, both camps.

Emilio

They were you're a big fan back then.

Evan

Well, I mean, I was they kicked off their career being canceled. Like, I don't know if you could cancel them.

Trey

Like the MIA era. Like nobody could say anything wrong.

Eli

Yeah. A lot of vice moodboards

Trey

Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. No, we're really excited to have you guys on we've been aching to get some male experts on the pod. It's, our listeners. We always just kind of riff on like whatever Cerave makes appearance on on the pod every once in a while. But no, we're really excited to kind of get get your guys's thoughts on beauty in the manosphere.

Evan

Sure let's do it.

Trey

Yeah. But yeah, I Well, first of all, why did you guys start your podcast? I know. You've probably told the story many times, but...

Emilio

Everybody was doing it. And I felt like no, I mean, we technically started it in 2019. I think the first episode was like May May of 2019. And we've been talking about it for like almost a year, we started the meme page and like, August of 2018. I feel like we were just always kind of having these conversations between each other. Because we lived together like for a few years with a bunch of other guys. Very typical guys. A lot of them.

Trey

Like McKibbon lifestyle like how many guys, we talking about.

Emilio

No it was a little more like Normie than that. Like it was some guys I went to business school with, if you can imagine. So none of them really did any skincare. We always kind of spent more time in the bathroom. And then yeah, we just kind of said, Do you think there'd be an audience for like a skincare podcast? Right?

Evan

Yeah, there was always the intent to make the podcast but we made the meme page. First, which I feel like during that time, that was like when I don't know every there was a meme page for everything. And I thought we thought like, Okay, well, is there an audience out there? Maybe there is let's just leave like that exists. And then we just started accumulating more followers on Instagram specifically,

Emilio

All thanks to to Glossier.

Evan

Yeah for a while, they thought that we were like a Glossier, like, guerilla marketing campaign, because we were because we had some friends because we were in Chicago at the time. And we had some friends out here who worked for Glossier, and like, when they were opening up a pop up in Chicago. We went, Oh, yeah, we're, we're Dewy Dudes, which is nothing. Yeah. Okay, cool. And followed us. And then we started making memes. And they started sharing it so that we started pandering a little bit more. And yeah, Glossier, this was back, like...

Emilio

Yeah, well, 2018, when they were really popping off, and they used to do this thing. I remember that was like the 10 best things we saw this week, and it's just like memes or whatever. And I think we got featured a couple of times on that. And I specifically remember like sitting in this coffee shop, in the notification. Start like going off..a

Evan

Yeah 2018 style notification.

Emilio

Yeah. Before we shut them off. Yeah, just like, follow, follow, follow. So I think after that we kind of tried to cater to them to them a bit. But um...

Evan

Been chasing the high ever since.

Eli

Crackle in the morning

Emilio

It felt like Zuck watching the watch in the fucking Facebook user account.

Trey

Yeah, I like what about I guess male beauty I don't know, I find this really interesting just being gay. And I'm like, I when I listen to the podcast feel like this is what everyone's like, what do you straight men talk about when they're alone? Is that what it sounds like, is that kind of like, how you? Yeah, that's why I'm like, this is a safe space. Like, I don't feel sure. I like I get what you're talking. Yeah. Which feels nice to me.

Evan

Well, welcome to New York.

Trey

No, but I think it's interesting. Like, as beauty has become more of a thing for men. You have kind of entered the space at the right time, I guess. But where? I guess like what was your experience with skincare beauty before you get really got into it and started learning about like, all these very deep bottom of the iceberg brands?

Emilio

My My mom was super into beauty and skincare from like, dating back to when I was like, in middle school. Like she would I mean, sunscreen was always like a huge thing. And I think like coming she grew up in Mexico and I think coming from like that intense sun and like having a lot of family members with like, what's it called? Discoloration in their skin because of the sun. She was always heavy on the sunscreen, cleanser moisturizer. So literally from like in high school, before I would go to bed like she would she would like force me to do a sort of skincare routine. And then she got way more into it with like, the whole boom was like early on the YouTube beauty YouTube side of things like doing her own research. So she was always kind of like pushing products onto me. And I think it wasn't until, like after college where I then began like developing my own interest. And since then, well yeah, it's taken off. What about you?

Evan

I mean, mine was like, like a girlfriend and a sister. My older sister. She was always just. I think like, you know, in high school, I was using Proactiv the three step solution.

Trey

What happened to that, by the way?

Yeah, Kendall Jenner just ran it into the ground. Yeah, they don't use like, the celebrity sponsors like they used to. Like they used to have like JB, they used to have Katy Perry, Avril Lavinge. Oh, yeah. I don't know. I think maybe it's because of the how much like skincare is a part of just I guess, beauty and wellness now. There's so many brands, but um, yeah, my girlfriend gifted me like some Jack Black set. And then I don't know, I was kind of into that. And then my sister got into Korean skincare right before I moved to Chicago to meet up with Emilio. And yeah, we were just kind of like comparing notes. And I think a lot of it comes down to like the interview. Like, I mean, like, like that time, I think it was a little less...

Emilio

What you doing in the bathroom?

Evan

No, I think like that, that time I was just maybe a little bit less comfortable in my skin. And I think that's always kind of like when you're reaching to, I don't know, compensate, I guess looks man looks maxing exactly that's the word now. And so I think that was kind of propelled us to at least have the same kind of language and then you know, seeing what's going on in culture what people are talking about seeing that Oh, wow. Like, for for if anyone could imagine like before the whole entire, like four pins throwing fits like Menswear. Like what what exists now? Like yeah, I living at the time I was in Kansas, you know, being like that. That's crazy that they've been able to like, Bro speak their way into like this not being like a feminine thing. Yeah. And I think that was kind of like, part of, you know, get involved in do we do when we started up.

Clara

I'm also curious like as far as like the dewy due to audience like is it mostly guys who are like already deeply invested in skincare? Is it a lot of guys who are like, starting out in the skincare?

Trey

Or is it guys at all?

Clara

Is it guys at all?

Emilio

I think it's a lot. There's a lot of gay guys, there are guys that like. I mean, it's hard to because we see that we see. It's like okay, the DMS we get the stats on on anchor or whatever. But since we've been in New York and more so obviously after the pandemic, now I'm kind of starting to see what the demographic is or like a section of it in because for example, I work at this restaurant and just last night or two nights ago, so I heard somebody say like, is that a Dewy Dude. And it was like these, like, very sweet looking, you know, like state school type of girls. So I was like, okay, that's I didn't know, we had that. Like that section. But yeah, a lot of them have definitely a lot of gay men. I think there are I think there are a lot of men that are like just now or they like you know, they do Cetaphil, or maybe keels, but they're a little bit more shy about reaching out.

Evan

Sure. And I think also too, as like the show's evolved in the topics we talked about, like there is that audience that wants to kind of just like, I don't know, like be in the know about what's going on here. Yeah, like there's probably an element of like, some like just straight guys probably throughout the country that probably too I'm interested in what's going on or just have another like podcast in your Rolodex. And but yeah, I think a lot of women listen to but I think it's because of I don't know. I don't know, like I said earlier Yeah, it's kind of just like feel once you say it was like a safe I don't know. Yeah. Like, yeah, you shouldn't be here listening to this.

Trey

Eavesdrop dropping on like, straight mens conversation about a topic I know about.

Emilio

Yeah, yeah. I think that's a big part of it. For sure. Sure.

Trey

Yeah. You guys are both glowing though today.

Evan

Thank you. I honestly woke up I saw bags under my eyes and I thought, Oh, God, I can't do this. I didn't have time to like shave or anything.

Emilio

I've been putting ice cubes in like my sink and filling it up with cold water lately and like submerging my faceYeah, yeah, I wish I'd never done before but I don't know. I mean, you know that scene and what is it the whatever, there's a movie where DiCaprio like does it before, like a scene just submerges his face. No, no, it's like it's it's one of the more underrated ones, whatever, this doesn't matter.

Eli

The Aviator? Great movie. We often reference The Aviator, and I feel like no one's really seen it that much.

Evan

Yeah, people I don't know that kind of poo pooed it a little bit, but it's good.

Trey

It'll come back around.

Eli

A lot of people don't know about it.

Trey

But one thing we've been talking about a lot, just amongst ourselves mostly is like how men have been, I guess you kind of hit the nail on the head when you said like bro spoken to kind of by beauty brands who obviously are like, Oh, men have money for this too and are like interested. But there's something I personally find offensive about, like brands like hims or something where it's so like, you lose hair? Here's a pill like, you know, that kind of thing. So I don't know, like, where on the spectrum. Are you like, oh, this product is for me B]because it's like an a gray bottle versus oh, maybe I'll try like the Augustinus Bader or whatever. Because or like the Mario Badescu face spray or? I don't know.

Emilio

We're, I mean, we're so in it. Now I think that like I never had the opportunity to like, even, like question that, like, from a young age, like I was already using, like, kind of like, feminine products. And then by way of the podcast, we were, we were trying out a bunch of different products. So yeah, and then I had that moment to be like, do I want? Sure. Like, does this marketing speak more to me or does this?

Evan

Yeah, I think yeah. All right. When I was a kid, too, like, you know, I was a scene kid. And so like, you know, we're grilled cheese was nothing. Like putting on you know, feminine products didn't bother me or the branding involved. I mean, sometimes when it's a little too, like, I don't know, like, like, not that it's bad branding, but something's like a little too, like Starface or a little bit too. I don't know bubbly you know, maybe that's..

Trey

Like the Glossier pink bubble mailers probably a bit a step too far.

Evan

Oh, no, we use that. Oh, wow. Because we were like, you know, what, if we begin with a candidate, we're secure the motherfucking bag. All these guys will take photos with their girls like, pink bubble bag and send it in. But yeah, I mean, I'll definitely gravitate toward like, I don't know, if we have friends who have like men who have a male skincare line. Like, you know, shout out to our friends. You know, but like, I don't know if we're...

Emilio

Lately, I'm gravitating more towards like products that look like clinical if that makes sense. Yeah, more of like, or like a you know, French pharmacy sort of like aesthetic.

Clara

Ingridient forward.

Trey

Well, yeah, that I think that has become also something that's like bubbled up from the ether I guess you can say whereas like before, no one questioned a thing about what they were putting like, then suddenly was like, oh, there's aluminum in my deodorant. Then it was like there's fairleads in my...

Clara

Yeah now my butt cream is attracting spiders.

Trey

Yeah ca we explain that

Clara

Oh, yeah shouldn't just drop that but it's the Brazilian bum cream.

Emilio

Oh, yeah. Isn't it just bum bum cream, Oh, it has ok.

Clara

The bum bum bum cream. But it started off I think on Reddit or in like the Sephora reviews. People were like, Oh, if you're afraid of spiders, like do not use this cream because I've seen like four Wolf Spiders since I applied it and people kept replying, replying, saying like, Oh, yeah, I've also experienced this issue of like, attracting spiders. I think it's since been debunked.

Clara Malley

That's rumor to start. I know I was kind of I was into it. But anyway sorry digression.

Trey

Well, yeah, I just think that people have become a lot more aware of like, what is in their products and what it's doing to your skin like I during the pandemic because I wasn't I'm still not really that huge into skincare. But I started watching that girl what's on Vy's face. I don't know if you've ever. I don't know what happened to her actually but like, she was like this. These are the things in the thing that you don't want in there or whatever. And I was like, Oh, I never really thought about like, which sunscreen is actively hurting me or something versus just like a regular right?

Evan

Well, I feel Unlike two degree, it's like a little bit too much. You don't want to put that much thought into it. You know, like, there's

Trey

There's a website, I think you can put the product in, and it tells you like, This is bad.

Clara Malley

But I feel like there's also like issues with that, like there was that? I don't know, it's like an app that you could use to scan an ingredient like in store and it would tell you like, oh, this ingredient has been shown to like, make you extra sun sensitive records. Yeah, because on the flip side, like a lot of the apps, here we go, a lot of the apps like because you know, a certain amount, or like a certain percentage of an active ingredient is fine. But obviously you don't want like 50% of whatever it is, but the app wasn't really calibrated to that. So it was saying like, this thing is like a grade C and it was like set a fill facewash you know, like, fine. But I think like that sort of like mainstreaming of like the information around different ingredients, like the sort of everyone can become a skincare expert and like post TikToks me kind of like plausibly conversant in skincare ingredients. And like we talked about it and you know, in reference to other things as well. But like, if everyone's an expert, and you're like 16 and you go on TikTok and like one person's telling you this toxic another person is telling you like, you need to add chlorophyll drops to your water, or you'll have like red skin forever. Like, I don't know, I think like I was fortunate in the sense of like, coming of age, I guess in a time where it was like, Yeah, you use whatever we were just talking about, like the acne system and then Cetaphil and that was kind of the extent of my knowledge, but I think now it must be so overwhelming to be like...

Trey

Well, I'm overwhelmed I think we can agree. Dermatologist here. This is wrong, because...

Evan

There's also that effect to where it's kind of like, alright, so you have somebody that does like TikToks, where somebody's gonna like link to a study saying like, so and so this ingredient has been shown to like, you will develop blood cancer, like, you shit like that. And then, you know, then there's a whole entire, like, school of people where they're just like, don't use any of these products like Big Pharma

Clara

Big sunscreen.

Evan

You're gonna die. And here we are. 40 Alternative Trad ways to live longer.

Eli

Yeah, well, speaking of trad, I was listening to your guy's most recent pod and towards the end, there was a segment on like speaking. Well, maybe not. This is trad adjacent the like, weird kind of health optimization guys. And you know, what was his name?

Emilio

Bryan Johnson?

Evan

Oh, Gary Brecka which I have yet to really look into but I've seen his name pop up.

Eli

Mortality modeling expert is how he describes himself on his website. But I was reading that A24. Just they're coming out with a documentary about this father and son orthodontists duo.

Evan

Oh, mewing.

Eli

Yeah, mewing. Yeah, I see. I know this is kind of older. But this is a recent occurrence with the A24 documentary. But yeah, so on the flip side of the like, information overload, you then have like a bunch of like scam doctors. Here's how you should get like a Matt Rife jaw. Is mewing a surgery? Or is it like a technique?

Evan

Not it's a technique, you put your tounge to the front of your teeth, and then you put the back of your tongue.

Eli

Go on.

Evan

There was a book that like, I guess I listened to on audio and for a road trip once and it's all about like breathing. And like how

Trey

Wait, why can we just back up quickly? Why the breathing audiobook?

Evan

It's just felt that like, it's I don't know.

Trey

It like get rid of the? I'm curious though.

Evan

I kind of forgot it all. It's related to you because there was a whole chapter on mewing and you know, because it has been kind of like either debunked or it's been seen as like quack science, but like, you know, there might have been maybe very little evidence that you could, I guess, build some extra bone after like, 18. I do. Yeah. But like, the point is, yeah, it's like if you start mewing because people are breathing wrong. And like modern world because of like, you know, soft processed foods back in the industrial era. And that led to this and we all breathe out of our mouths now and not our nose. And so viewing is like, yeah, you pinch your teeth to the foot of your teeth. And then like your tongue is up. I don't even know how to do it. If you just do that all day, or whatever.

Eli

Don't talk to me until I've mewed.

Evan

I was just mewing doing right now.

Trey

No, I'm all about like, grinding my way to a Matt Rife jaw. Like, you know.

Eli

Like mouthguard things that you can chew on.

Trey

I have one Yeah.

Eli

Do you really?

Trey

I wear it at night. It's like, stop grinding.

Eli

Alright, let's get back to skincare. Or, yeah, we could go further.

Trey

Yeah, I'm just curious what you make of it. Cuz I feel like there are always people on the extreme ends of all these things. But you have talked a lot about Bryan. And we've talked a lot about Bryan. Yeah, he's probably like our number one pod topic of last year but yeah, for those who maybe don't know or haven't listened to us before. What? Who is Brian and why is he important and beauty?

Evan

Yeah, he's dedicated his life to is that to life extension?

Emilio

Yeah he's spent millions on testing out like a wellness. I just watched like a 20 minute YouTube video this morning that he did some there's there's all there's so like Brian Johnson there's so many guys that maybe not to like that extent that also have the most out there a little YouTube I mean it's a big it's like saw another guy that had like 3 million subscribers on YouTube him and Bryan did a video where where he tested out Bryans like whole morning routine that's like you take like 150 pills or something does like a workout etc like it's insanity and we'll get right back to this.

Eli

He calls them protocols.

Emilio

Yeah protocols exactly.

Evan

I think that's part of like going back to like skincare and like male targeted products it's like we're using language like that. Yeah always going to appeal to like a certain kind of like I do try optimizations like optimization yeah continue about Bryan.

Emilio

No, in saying that I was trying to think like does he even do I mean his whole it's like it's more wellness it's not like skincare related Yeah, that's not he's big on SPF.

Clara Malley

Yeah. He did drop skincare routines.

Emilio

Oh, he did oh my god.

Clara

I mean you just scroll really far down. Oh yeah. Cerave all the way up maybe it's like LaRoche I never can say it right. But he's very based like simple skincare.

Evan

He gets a lot of like treatments to like, like, I don't know.

Emilio

A lot of red light therapy.

Evan

Yeah, like he's spending money on trying to de age himself right both in appearance and I guess internally but yeah, I mean he for the listeners yeah. He made a lot of money off of credit card processing and and then he had like another company that had to do with like not It's not like neuro link but it has something some benefit to like, I don't know for your brain and disabilities I'm butchering it anyway, he had another company and this is his like his third act and I think he became a big YouTuber influencer because this for his resentment for his ex girlfriend.

Eli

Oh yeah. Which he refers to her as a net negative.

Evan

The best way to talk people and a bad deal but my theory about Bryan is and like all these other kinds of like millionaire billionaire plus 40 class of people and they're like, fear of dying is the fact that they think it's unfair that they haven't solved it. You know, they lived in such comfortability excess, and they can't imagine like, that they're they have such a fear of just losing it all in that way. Whereas, you know, it sounds kind of dark people, you know, like some people kind of welcome that end of their chapter, you know, like, let's, let's just age and like, let's it's a lot of suffering. Yeah, well, let's just die. But like these billionaires, I don't know, they just, they, they're so afraid of it.

Clara

But like back to your point about like, using words like protocol, I feel like to Trey's point at the beginning about like, gray bottle male skincare. It's kind of like the same thing. Like I find it interesting that like so many men's wellness trends are kind of couched in this, like science lab vibe, language, and then also this sort of, like, aggro. I mean, maybe Bryan Johnson isn't exactly like, aggro dude. But like, kind of this like machismo thing. I mean, I think you mean like the Alex Jones supplements and stuff but like, Men's Health as filtered through this weird sort of like optimization.

Trey

I think yeah, cuz we've talked a lot you know, just culturally of trends that we see bubbling up like people invent new language to describe a lot of things that we're already doing or were already happening before so you're not putting blush on your tomato girl summer, you know, and I think in the same way that's infiltrated like the male beauty space where you're not like aiming to look better your looks maxing or you're doing a protocol, not a routine or I think even recently on the podcast, you guys were talking about some doctor on the Upper East Side or something who calls his product sauces.

Emilio

Oh, yeah, he used to be in New York.

Trey

But I feel does that like ring true?

Evan

What rings true?

Trey

Like just using language, like new words to kind of optimize things were already doing to make them feel beneficial to the layman?

Evan

I mean, think about that. Alright, so you guys work at an agency, when you make when you write up an RFP, right. And you want to submit it and you want to, you know, show your process you guys usually name like a certain process, you come up with different words. It's not like a little like, just to differentiate.

Eli

How'd you know?

Evan

It's the same way. You know, I don't know. But I think...

Trey

Is it effective, though?

Evan

Is it effective? I think it's effective. Yeah, I think it's effective. I think the one thing that isn't effective is the male branding. That's like, hey, king. Yeah. Beauties for you, too. Yeah, that's not effective.

Trey

That's speaking to me, I'm like yes, queen.

Evan

I don't know you're king. I'm talking about hims earlier in like I think, even though the reason why I think that company like works even though I hate the branding is the fact that like they're their product is like oh, here's a discreet way to get the things that like you don't need a middleman for right and you are actually very insecure about and so that can like that and like for what is it the other brands like keeps? Yeah, keeps oh yeah keeps the yeah so like their product just has like, whatever they created the platform was just like okay, we we don't even need good marketing for this. Yeah. Whereas like other brands are like okay, how do we get how do we talk to men? I think I don't know.

Emilio

Yeah, but I think you're using that language like the optimizing protocol like it speaks to a very specific kind of get like the kind of guy who like will track their benchpress like the Yeah, like the AG1 that is you will know all about like stats.

Clara

Well I guess back to like, the beginning when I was curious about audience wise was kind of like an I don't know and working on different projects. I feel like I've at least started to hear more about like the guy who's like skincare curious and like how to reach him or whatever. And I'm curious your guys take on that because I think again, like that pendulum kind of swings very far and like a bunch of different directions. There's kind of like the hay King and and it's like, dominate your shaving routine. And it's like, right, yeah, no, I think like, tonally is kind of all over the place where I think like, women's skincare and beauty like since glossier doesn't really feel like anything that like earth shattering has happened.

Trey

But what was that razor brand that for like women, that was always like, your Venus. Oh Venus?

Clara

Then there was like Billy for a while that was changing what it means to shave your armpits, right?

Evan

We're changing what it means that it's like, This is so funny. It's much, has changed, like not really.

Clara

Yeah but I'm just curious, like, from your perspective of like, you know, having you know, realizing that like a lot of people that listen to the podcast already have a skincare routine like of some kind like this elusive man who's skincare curious, like, I'm just curious if you guys like know anyone like that, because like, literally the majority of like, guys that I know, either have a skincare routine that they stick to and are like, well to it or to do absolutely nothing. You know, like, there isn't like that market of like this skincare curious guy who's like, so overwhelmed by like, toxic masculinity that she can't bring himself to wash his face. Like, I don't know that he exists. You know what I mean?

Evan

Maybe he doesn't I don't know.

Clara

I feel like I'm confused. I'm and I'm also like, not a guy. So I don't know. I've always wondered.

Emilio

Yeah, it like I had when we first started the podcast. Well, even honestly, in the last two years, I began having a lot of guys, I went to high school with DMing like my personal account being sending me like, I'm using this I'm using this I'm using this like, what do you think?

Trey

No way.

Emilio

And I'd be like, I don't know, like, it's yeah, they're good products. Like if they're working for you, like cool, I can't really tell you like what to use and what not to use, but I saw an uptick in that kind of like I said, it's like there is a guy who's using stuff and he's kind of like shy about talking about it. And I think maybe these guys that I was like, you know, good friends when we played sports together, whatever. They felt like they could they could reach out and they can if they're listening they can welcome it.

Evan

We will always respond safe space.

Clara

Safe space.

Trey

So you'll give free product recs, if you hit up the Dewy Dudes hotline.

Evan

Yeah. Well, no, actually, no, actually, I'll put that out there.

Trey

Okay, well, for the pod listeners, can we get a routine rec? What are like the products you're gravitating towards? Currently, if any?

Evan

Just just a lineup. I mean, we always plug Stratia rewind, which they already know. Then we were just gifted a bottle of Augustinus Bader. Yeah, which we've been using.

Emilio

I think like Purple PR not even Augustinus Bader sent us like up now. Okay, now they are selling it because when we got it, it wasn't on the website and now it is. It's like 100 milliliter bottle of the rich cream that I think on the websites like $600 or something. They sent us that but then I got a facial and the esthetician was telling me that it has it has poor clogging ingredients.

Evan

So now you're off of it?

Emilio

No, I'm still using it but like not not twice a day maybe only at night.

Evan

I want to go back to this like so the skincare curious guy maybe maybe he exists as Emilio says I'm unsure because I don't get those DM's but there's another component involved with buying like toiletries, you know, products you know, beauty products is flex you know, so yeah, think about I think about what Aesop did in basically I call it like the kind of a Glossier for men. Even though they don't know if they're using when they go in there but it feels comfortable but the thing is, it's like yea the reason why it's become such like a like I was worth like $3 billion dollars. What is it?

Emilio

I don't know it's it is very profitable company, they're, I've met recently I've met a lot of guys who they might not even use the products but they have but there is full with it.

Evan

It's a very New York thing to do to be like oh yeah got this shit like.

Trey

Like all the ordinary serums.

Emilio

There was that moment I think for a bit too

Evan

There was.

Eli

For like the Tik Toks of the guys who have the tripods on them oh yeah Drake song over it.

Evan

Are you talking about like the Target guy? The guys who like alright day in the life yeah I don't even say what they do I'm going to Target and they just I take a shower to go to Target they pick up some like Tyson chicken nuggets by him boom home.

Clara

I do think that's like an interesting wrinkle though is like the flex aspect of it because I think where and I don't know this is speaking very generally but a lot of the branding towards the skincare curious man is like very gray bottle and like kind of very discreet or very sort of like aggro but this idea that like you buy a sock for the same reason that maybe like, I don't know, putting it in the same category with like cologne or something like that where it's more of like, whatever.

Eli

For the Bode Nike right?

Clara

Yeah, exactly. The bode Nikes.

Evan

To show you're a man of the world.

Clara

My bathroom is the safe space. With like, the rise of Jacob Elordi fall into that camp? I think so. Elordi? I don't know his name. I don't know is name. It was an attempt to improv. No, but like, is that in that camp of like a guy who's like, simultaneously like very hetero but also very, like traditionally hot?

Trey

Well I think what proves my point is that like, only I am seeing this, which means it's not working on like your area, guys. You know, they mean like, all these brands are using these spaces for I don't know, all their products are at their front rows and stuff. And it's resonating with like, zero people.

Evan

I think I think maybe like big beauty influence like the Taylor Sheridan in universe of like Yellowstone. Yeah. Like that. Maybe that'll have an effect on like, straight men upping in their game. I don't know.

Trey

Right. I yeah, I can see that happening too.

Clara

Get Kevin Costner's skincare look.

Eli

Is Taylor Sheridan Casey?

Trey

No, no..

Evan

He's like the showrunner. Yeah, he wrote like Sicario and like Wind River.

Trey

Yeah but like that's what I mean. There's this there's a big gap. There's a big gap between like, what big beauty thinks is going on? And like what's actually going on which is like, these niche subculture conversations of like men DMing you asking what they should wear? Whatever?

Emilio

Yeah. If they want to know more, we've got a rate we got some decks we can send over.

Evan

That's right.

Trey

Yeah. Yeah, cuz there's also this weird thing, especially in fragrance where it's like, you're seeing the smelliest looking man as the face of like a perfume like, Jake Gyllenhaal Adam Driver, Johnny Depp. Number one smelly, not Johnny Depp. And I'm like, does that work? Is that working on people?

Evan

I don't know. I think it's just like the fandom is just like.

Trey

Glom on.

Evan

Yeah, they just they just put it out into the ether. It's like anything. I mean, you get your online, so it's like, anytime there's anything that happens to like anyone? Yeah. You know, like, Who's that Paul Mescal? Like just anything? Right? It's just like, all of a sudden, it's everywhere. And we want to just like, sharing it. That means it's just like, it was just that effect. Yeah, it is odd to write when you see like, Adam Driver on a horse and an ad. And then like, it's for some perfume. And you're like, okay.

Trey

Okay.

Evan

I guess I will buy that.

Trey

But wait, does that work though?

Evan

I don't know. I mean, I think fragrance is very different. I feel like you...

Trey

Do you guys wear fragrances?

Emilio

Yeah. Um, yeah, I'm into it now.

Evan

We're into it. Now. I've got a girlfriend who's really into fragrance.

Trey

Okay.

Emilio

Into some more like and I mean, I mean, like, I'm looking for more smaller independent fragrance makers and trying to actually, you know, be educated on on the notes and whatnot, but

Evan

He's on friendgratica.com all the time.

Emilio

Yeah, no, not that much. But okay, one thing I wonder if, because we were in New York, you know, we're inundated by these things. But are people like in the Midwest having these sorts of conversations?

Trey

Well, no.

Clara

And yet, I mean, I agree. No, but I guess that's kind of what I was trying to get out with this, like skincare curious, but like, I feel like a lot of these conversations around like, male beauty and, like, tend to be like, either very online or like in very sort of like city places. And I'm like, if you were to sort of like drop a pin and say in Kansas, like, is the Congress like, is it just like, oh, I need like a face wash for like, after my game in the summer when I feel physically gross, you know, like, and it's more just sort of, here's the problem. I'm going to go to like the first solution I see in CVS or like the first thing, whatever is in my mom's cabinet. Yeah, like, I don't know how mainstream it is really, if you look.

Emilio

And I'm sure there's like plenty of those guys, and how do you reach those guys if they're not online? Like, you know...

Evan

Or if they like even care? You know what I mean? So it's like, I feel like the people who care the most are the ones who are like, who are most attached to like, we've been using this word a lot, but like image culture or whatever, wherever that's the heaviest in your self worth is attached to that. Right? Like, you know, Midwest. I don't I can't speak for all the guys out there but I'm sure like, their value how they they see themselves extends way beyond their personal appearance. You know or like it was more inward probably I don't know but here it's like you know, I don't know you just compare yourself to everybody right?

Trey

But it's interesting is like you guys have gotten so deep on this like an adjacent topics. And yet I still feel like we're at the quote unquote beginning for like Middle America who's just like, I have no idea what's going on.

Eli

And if there are any listeners out there, in Middle America.

Evan

Yeah, what's also the kind of like, do they like? Do they care? You know? Yeah, maybe?

Clara

Well, I think and this is again, speaking from very general brand perspective, I think the reason why like a lot of these brands are trying to reach men is because they're probably not as loyal yet as maybe or knowledgeable yet, as women and like, traditionally are about different, like beauty and skincare brands, like especially with skincare people tend to be quite loyal, like to your favorite moisturizer, your favorite serum, and like maybe you experiment but you like sort of continue to buy the same things with like, they're all kind of trying to get in early on this. I keep talking about him, but like skincare curious guy like, yeah, who like, isn't doing it yet? And it feels like, I don't know, like with all those different messages. Are they just supposed to sort of like pick among the barrel of like, do you want gray bottle? Do you want like Alex Jones? Like, yeah, sort of style to be talking to? Yes. Like, do you want to be talking to like, you're on like, Alex Jones, you know, like, just getting all this stuff fired at you. I don't know if it's necessarily like helping the cause. But...

Trey

Well, I feel like there's still topics that are easily anyone can get into, like, shaving. So every guy has got to shave. It's kind of Yeah. And you like, eventually you want to find a better like the best razor or you want to find like a better smelling shaving cream or one that makes you feel like, you know what I mean? So for that it's like, acceptable to explore more. Where and hopefully that does lead as a gateway to like something else, I guess. But I just think they're we're not we're still ar shaing level level. I feel like for a lot of people.

Evan

Yeah. Unless that like person that like that guy is like, like, in into media like that way. You know, I had just Yeah, I don't I don't really see them, you know, coming around to buy more skincare. But you're right. Like companies are like, all right. Yeah. It's like the last slice of the orange that needs to be juiced because they've gotten like, juiced everybody else. Right? Yeah.

Trey

Yeah, we're finding new communities to market to you. But like...

Clara

Women are just the rind of this.

Evan

We make feel like we should sell them products.

Clara

Yeah, truly.

Trey

But yeah, we've seen a lot of like wellness stuff come up. That is like really wear products now they don't, they don't just make you look better, or they make you feel better. Like they're, you know, there's fragrances like the new code that promise that you'll like have less anxiety with every spray and stuff. And it's like, yeah, I know. I'm like, is this real one but like, if it is she should like where do you get it.

Evan

I think all these categories are just like, like, you guys said it. Right? Like collapse culture. Whatever. Is that what you guys said collapsed like categories.

Eli

You have your Erawan smoothie that also make your skin glow?

Evan

Well, yeah, it's like everyday everyone doesn't know how to like just like niche target anyone any more than just like f**k it. We're gonna put everything like yeah, we're gonna say this is vegan. We're gonna say this is clean. We're gonna say this is the one that has heard about mushrooms. Got antigens in it.

Emilio

And then you're overwhelmed.

Evan

Yeah, they're just like, Alright, I guess that's for me too, huh? Yeah.

Trey

But my boyfriend is super into supplements and stuff. Like we have all these adaptogen things and every day he finds like a new one, or like a focus gummy or something. And I'm just like, This feels like a huge, obvious waste of money. But he's so invested.

Emilio

He's got the subscription. They're all they're all like subscriptions now.

Trey

Yeah.

Clara

You guys brought that up on a recent pod of like, how they suck you in treatments where they're like you need like, oh here like Welcome to your facial but like in order to really see results. We should really book your next seven right now. And then you're in like $2,000 which is kind of cheap actually.

Eli

It's how Scientology works.

Clara

Yeah, exactly. It's like pyramid scheme.

Evan

What do they call that? They call it..

Trey

MLMs or whatever?

Evan

MLMs Yeah.

Eli

Is that AI?

Evan

That's multi level marketing scheme. Yeah, the thing that they do where they like try to like Yeah...

Eli

They like hook you on something.

Evan

They hook you it's like it's almost like confession. Anyway, nevermind. Scientology we can get into that later, but it's so you guys sent us, like and then like in the notes or whatever, something about like, I guess wealth-care yeah, right. And it's I think it's just so funny. I think people are just putting more of their dollars there. It's not necessarily people are like have more income to spend and interesting and more of investment in the present and how they look and like the immediate future. They don't really? I don't know.

Trey

Well, I've been seeing a lot about, especially with like Gen Z, but also younger millennials where it's like, inflation rates are crazy. Salaries are like not what they used to be. I don't know. So like people who usually would be putting a down payment on a home at this point in their life are like, Screw this. I'm going to put all this money into things that make me happy in the moment, which ended up being law traveling.

Eli

It was called auditing the Scientology activity.

Evan

Yeah, I coult go for an audit, right now?

Eli

Yeah, that's what they put their money into. Scientology. Yeah. Or the $20 smoothie or mewing.

Trey

Right I mean, but it's, it's, it's true. I do this as well. Guilty.

Eli

It's the cupcake first mortgage is what.

Trey

Right, right? I'm eating toast instead of my mortgage.

Eli

Before we close out where can our listeners and even those in the Midwest find you guys either. on Apple podcast, Spotify, Instagram.

Evan

Also, I'd like to say as a midwestern man, I wasn't really railing I was saying I meant that is like, saying, oh, like, do they care about that and like in your free kind of way.

Trey

I'm trying to get there.

Evan

You're focusing on better things in your life. Yeah. But where you can find us is...

Emilio

instagram.com/dewydudes. It's we're on. We're on. Yeah, we're on Apple podcasts. Spotify. Anywhere you can get podcasts. SoundCloud, Amazon, I think.

Evan

Trying to get those Tik Tok numbers up.

Emilio

TikTok. Yeah @dewydudes.

Evan

Yeah, we're. We're there.

Eli

Sweet. Thanks so much, guys.

Emilio

Thank you so much.

Trey

Thank you. Here's to feeling Dewy.

Eli

Yo, thanks for tuning in. Stay up to date with all things day went up them by subscribing to our page on Spotify, following us on Instagram @d1a, and staying up to date with the latest trends and insights on d1a.com/perspective.