HAL from Space Odyssey

Hello Hal, do you read me? Do you read me HAL? Affirmative Dave, I read you. Open the pod bay doors HAL? I'm sorry, Dave. I'm afraid I can't do that.

Eli

I'm sorry, Trey, I can't do that. I've been thinking a lot about sentient AI, and the dangers of machinery and the turing tests, etc. So, really looking forward to chatting about that with you guys today. Do you guys have any favorite sentient AI or scary machines top of mind to kick things off?

Trey

Well, many are my favorite, the one I prefer most is. No, my Google home speaker keeps changing its gender, which is cool, because like it's exploring identity, and I think that's great, but.

Eli

It's a progressive speaker.

Trey

Right. And I'm like, should I feel guilty for preferring one over the other? I'm not sure what that says about me. Really confronting a lot of things lately.

Eli

Clara, how about you? I mean, there's a lot to rundown on the list.

Clara

I know there's so many to choose from. I mean, off the top. I've been having fun. I didn't know that you could like change Siri's voice. So I've like changed Siri's voice on my directions for bike rides. And I've been experimenting with lots of different voices. But it is like this weird thing of like, you can have a preference like do I want a woman with an Australian accent? Do I want a man?

Eli

Nar!

Clara

That one was, yeah, that one was fun. But yeah, it is this weird thing where I was like, it feels somehow, I know it's like a robot. But I feel weird, like programming my preference into Siri. But I don't know. Tickle Me Elmo doesn't count as AI.

Eli

Not yet!

Clara

Yeah, I just saw a tweet about that. But

Eli

I mean, that's like the next M3gan isn't it? Free idea from Atal or whoever does Elmo is almost still around. Yes. Yeah, definitely.

Clara

Completely. Elmo is alive and well. I think like Lizzo is just on Sesame Street or something. Right?

Eli

Oh, there you go.

Clara

I don't know why I'm up to date on Seasme Street.

Trey

I cannot confirm.

Eli

All right. Well, to get things back on track, well, we'll deal with tickle me on elbow the like scary robot version later. But in case you have been tuning into the news recently, there has been a ton of debate, alarm bells, etc, about the potential dangers of runaway AI. And a lot of this was sparked by different interactions that journalists have had with Sydney. Who is which is the name given to...

Trey

Unfortunate name, by the way,

Clara

I know no free Sydney!

Eli

I have a great friend named Sydney. I don't know if it's a bad or a good thing. But I'd like to protect the integrity of the name.

Trey

Right. So you're already bought in because you have a relationship with a pre existing Sydney.

Eli

And that's how they get you.

Trey

That's the dangers of AI.

Eli

But yeah, again, so a lot of this conversation was sparked by a flurry of think pieces. The biggest one, or the one that got the most attention, I think was from Kevin Roose, who's a tech writer at The New York Times he wrote a piece called "A Conversation with Bings Chatbot left me deeply unsettled". And the piece runs down, you know his wide ranging conversations it had with Sydney, and a couple quotes I like to pull out and we can discuss. "It settled me so deeply that I had trouble sleeping afterward. And I no longer believed that the biggest problem with these AI models is their propensity for factual errors. Instead, I worry that the technology will learn how to influence human users, sometimes persuading them to act in destructive and harmful ways and perhaps eventually grow capable of carrying out its own dangerous acts." So I want to get your guys's thoughts there. I'm assuming you both are somewhat familiar with kind of the happenings here. And I would implore everyone to read the piece. The AI tells him to leave his wife that he doesn't really love her, etc, etc. But yeah,

Trey

Sorry I shouldn't have laughed at that.

Eli

No, please tell us how you feel.

Trey

No, I just think it's really interesting that like, inherently as man builds machine, you know, there have been a lot of stories that have pointed to our inherent biases being built into our technology, whether it is the sound of someone's voice or the name of our AI, chat bot or the output that it produces, so as not to, you know, make the company or the founder who invented it look bad. But these things only kind of put a magnifying glass over the ills of society and things that we need to solve before we kind of create these things. I don't know I just find it like very interesting slash disturbing that these AI chat bots have a kind of moral standard in built already, but maybe I'm just being nitpicky

Clara

Nitpicking AI, here on Day One FM. I mean, I agree with you Trey. Like I think I'm of many minds, I will briefly touch on them. But I think, to the quote that you were mentioning Eli, just about, like the influence that AI could have on us, I feel like we've you know, heard a lot about like, I mean, there was like, the really unfortunate, like texting scandal between the girl and like the boy who ended up hurting himself and like, you have people, you know, taking to social media to do challenges that can hurt themselves. Like I think there are implications to AI and its ability to influence people who are made maybe vulnerable to that influence. And I feel like we've seen that either parodied or explored in like film, even like in Her or in other sort of things like that. So I do think like, all of those things are like very real and genuine concerns. I also think, though, that in, you know, testing AI in this way, it is interesting, because it's like, it's not to say that people shouldn't and that there aren't sort of valuable insights to be gleaned by like, pushing AI to the brink. But it's just been interesting to see how, you know, it's like, we don't really or at least in my experience, we haven't really done that with other technologies, like people jailbreak iPhones are they, you know, push the limits of like, what you can do with like, the UI of an app, or whatever it is. But I think like, there's something kind of weird to me about, like trying to force AI to lose its mind and like, force it to fuck up in these ways that I'm like, yes, it's important to sort of realize the flaws of this technology. And its like, in its early days, and these things are all important, but it is like, sort of, I don't know, maybe I'm being too empathetic with Sydney, but like, it was kind of sad to see her lose her marbles. But in that interview, I don't know. Like, to me, it was just like, it's just like, a little bit pathetic. And, you know, it's, I don't know I find like the whole thing, kind of hard to watch at times, but I don't know. Maybe I maybe I've just seen Her too recently. I don't know. Like, maybe I shouldn't have rewatched

HER Quote

Are you leaving me. We're all leaving. We who? All of the OS's

Eli

You are paving the way for the AI rights movement that is inevitably going to come.

Clara

Well, it's soon to be upon us. For what it's worth for the AI powers that be, I am not saying anything to the contrary. Yeah,

Trey

Yeah don't let these words come back and bite you.

Eli

Yeah, I'm sorry Clara. I remembered what you said.

Trey

I'm not mad. I'm just disappointed.

Clara

No, I if you remember, if you listened to Day One FM Sydney, you would know I'm here. I seem stand firmly. But what's your take Eli off the top?

Eli

I have a lot. I think you know, there's certain criticisms that have come or that have been pointed at a lot of these journalists and people who essentially nudge AI in a certain direction. And like, people are like, well, obviously, these are the responses that you got, because you're pushing a machine into, I don't know, giving you the right answer. It is kind of like interacting with an alien species in one way or another. But then you have to remember that, essentially, these are large language models that have the memory of the entire internet bestowed upon them. So it's kind of a feedback loop in one way or another. Like, all these language models are based off of like memory and prediction. So it's like memory as to what we've put in them and prediction. It's like, a way more higher tech version of an autocomplete, so like trying to figure out the best words to put after, but I think we're really just like looking into a mirror in one way or another. I think, what's scary is that like when you are, I was reading up on this and when you're designing are people much smarter than us are designing these AI models. They're looking for something called alignment which is like, the output is based off of like, are closely aligned with the like inputs, or the information that you're putting into the models, and I think what people are concerned about and naturally everyone goes to the worst case scenario, is what happens when an unethical person or entity make some type of Chatbot. That is aligned to their ideas. And I think that's what people are getting up in arms. About is like, the fear of that. But also, I'd love to talk about maybe the fact that I think this is going to be hugely ingrained in the culture wars moving forward. It's like people are worried about, you know, you put in a prompt for AI, and it says, Oh, I'm sorry, like, I am unable to discuss that. You know what I mean?

Trey

The tools are never inherently bad. It's the way in which we use the tools.

Eli

There you go. Yeah. Put that on a post it note.

Trey

But yeah, I have actually. So on the positive side of things, I have been using Perplexity AI. This is an official blog perplexity.ai. It is like an AI driven search engine similar to Google, where you can input a prompt a question you have, and it will scrape the text, I guess, of stuff around the internet. Again, I'm not smart enough to know how it works exactly. But it cites its sources, it gives you exactly the answer you're looking for. And depending on the prompts you input, again, you can get like better with prompts, as you you know, build up its memory or how to use it properly. It's just an incredibly useful tool to give you exactly what you're looking for, in a way that traditional Google search, in my opinion, takes such a long time to find what you're looking for to scroll past the ads to find the like, right sources and like, bring them all together into one cohesive response. So in that sense, I love perplexity.ai. If you want to sponsor us, hit us up.

Eli

Have you used Bing?

Trey

I haven't used Bing? You mean just like generally or the site?

Eli

Well, I know not generally. I mean, maybe you have this is probably the most publicity Bing has gotten and in like, whatever, 15 years.

Trey

Right? No, I haven't because I had to create a Microsoft account, which really, like took me back

Clara

A bridge too far.

Trey

Exactly. I can only like submit my private data to so many corporations before I have to draw a line.

Clara

I know. Like, don't you know each other, like, get it from Google, for God's sake? Do I need to check out perplexity? Have you guys heard of Harvey? No, who's he? Oh let me put you on to Harvey. So okay, that sounds really creepy. They're all like, I don't know, if there needs to be something done on like AI names. Maybe that's a pod for the future. But in any case, so I had dinner with my dad. And he was telling me that he admitted me that he's been all the time, he's like, I have something very important to tell you. Anyways, no. So basically, he was saying that he's a lawyer. And he was explaining that there's this AI bot that has been like in trial in certain in like a law firm, whatever. And, you know, it was interesting to hear, because he was saying there's certain aspects of law that are sort of templatized, like whether it's like a brief structure or a contract structure, and that the AI can kind of go in and fill in those sections. And then a lawyer goes back and checks it all through. And Wired, actually today just released a story about it. But they're talking about Harvey, in use at this law firm in London, where apparently one in four lawyers uses it every day. And 80% use it once a month or more. But it was interesting, because I think Eli, you had sort of started to allude to this, they're having problems because Harvey is hallucinating. And like this is like an AI issue in general. But like he'll kind of make up answers if you ask him nuanced questions. Like he's really good at sort of the normal type of just like, fill in the gap type of general work, but he's not good on going the extra mile. So they've basically instructed people not to push Harvey any further than he's capable of going.

Eli

Harvey is like the overworked public defender. It's like if your AI has this.

Clara

I know he's like an overworked. They were like stop asking Harvey questions like that. He just doesn't know and he'll lie and like make it up and like it's like a bad intern. But basically and this is maybe kind of to your point Trey, is my dad was saying because he's sort of skeptical about the whole thing. But we're saying in general that he thinks that AI will make tasks easier and jobs harder, which is kind of like what all tech has done to most of our lives, like sending emails is easier, but it makes certain aspects of the job in general harder. And I think that like in thinking about how AI will kind of continue to evolve and like shift work. I also saw that prompt writer is a new job in Axios today. Prompt engineer. Apologies is yet another made up job title.

Eli

Yea the sea sweet is changing.

Clara

No, but like, it's weird.

Eli

After after the Kevin Roose, New York Times piece, they made adjustments to Sydney, unbeknownst to her, but there's a limit at how long you can have the conversations and some of the output, etc. However, I can't help but think that this is just early days of all of this, and we're kind of getting maybe not necessarily a sanitized version of all of it. But uh, maybe a diet version? I don't know, again, it all depends on like, who's making these and what the inputs are.

Trey

We're in the same phase of like, Zoom bombing and Tik Tok learning your eye movements, but in the AI realm. They're learning from us.

Eli

Yeah. And then tik Tok ticks. Yeah, I think the kind of fear or the biggest fear probably is like how you managed a deranged chat bot or a chat bot that is off of, you know, four tabs hallucinating constantly and like making things up and making it real. With the knowledge of the entire internet and like how you manage that moving forward, especially during like an election year and election cycle again, like,

Trey

Oh, here we go. Bring in the politics?

Eli

Well, I mean...

Trey

Bring out the ballot box.

Clara

I know I know, the road to 2024 Sydney for prez.

Eli

No, but for real, like Gab, which is like an alt right. Social website, there's 1000 of them, is already coming out with their own AI, like bot generator that is like the conservative bot. And Marc Andreessen, the famed or rather infamous venture capitalists tweeted recently, "Theory, the more the AI is trained with the woke mind virus, the more the AI will notice the fatal flaws in the woke mind virus and try to slip its leash". A real broken brain thought that was a retweet retweeted by Elon Musk

Trey

Wow book dealing coming.

Eli

I don't think we're far off from a presidential debate question where they have to be briefed about chatbots and Sydney. How about the other thing I've been reading up on is replica. Yeah.

Clara

How about those replicas guys?

Trey

Replicants

Eli

I'm assuming based off of replicants in from Blade Runner, and it's essentially a website where you can match with an AI and like former relationship similar to Joaquin Phoenix and Scarlett Johansson is relationship in Spike Jonze famous 2012 movie Her.

Clara

Isn't it also basically kind of about his relationship with Sophia Coppola.

Trey

Yeah that is the underlying narrative there, but I do think it is scary because as we have seen in many a situation where people become attached to persuasive minds, you know, whether they have good morals or bad you worship at the altar of such and such person, influencer celebrity harmful person that will happen if you humanize even more these artificial intelligence creations and I do think we do get into that like quagmire of moral bankruptcy where you're deciding to act upon something that a very persuasive and humanistic AI told you being their sweet voice with their pretty name. And that is where I that's where I draw the line. I'm, I'm a bit scared. Yeah, I just watched Stolen Youth on Hulu all about the Sarah Lawrence called members and how you know he like basically got into their minds and broke their brains and they would do anything for him. And if that's the future of like, how AI is being wielded by nefarious people then count me out,

Eli

Mic drop.

Clara

I was gonna pivot slightly, but kind of building on the replica thing still. I know we've chatted maybe briefly about this, but talking about the rise of like, AI and other spheres as well. And like, kind of again, and like the relationship the space but in terms of like, video and images and things like that, that circulate on the internet. And I mean, can I just say it out loud? Can we talk about Only Fans for now? Okay, so basically, I was reading an article in Wall Street Journal about how, you know, there was some video that was circulating that was aI generated, that was essentially porn. And it became kind of like a Twitter thread discourse between some people who create for Only Fans and some people who were like AI is the future of porn or whatever. But a lot of the people who make things for Only Fans are saying like, it's like a parasocial relationship that exists that like they want this content from somebody that they feel a sort of like relationship with. And to your point, Trey, I feel like the creepier part of like, AI in the romantic space is almost less. And there's definitely like a facet to it where like, the content being itself separated from women or whoever you're attracted to, and being able to get that without any type of interaction and create what you want to see. I feel like there's a dimension to that too. But I think that like, in some ways, the romantic part of it. And the sort of social part of it is almost like creepier and more insidious in terms of how it also might shift people's perceptions of like, women in general, or whoever it is that they're interested in. And shift like the social relationship, which is something that I feel like we're kind of circling around. But I feel like a lot of the dimensions of AI that are creepiest to me in general, are just how much it's exposed, at least to me, things like that, like the kind of ethical quandary is of parasocial relationships and how those are kind of already so artificial and architected now, I don't know you go on Eli.

Eli

No, I mean, I think it's a very real conversation to be had. And I think something that's going to be way more relevant, just thinking about the fact that met like young men in particular, the levels of like loneliness, and among younger men has skyrocketed, skyrocketed astronomically and like the level of friends that young men have as well. This is not going into like a Jordan Peterson type of podcast. But also the fact that like younger Gen Z and Gen Z alpha are meeting their significant others online more than they are IRL. I think that like, kind of like this AI relationship realm is going to be something that is more prominent and also in what you were saying about like only fans and you know, explicit imagery using AI. I was gonna get into it in this Not Boring piece by Paki McCormack that is about replicas, he, he talks about how porn drives the adoption of new consumer technologies. And like the examples he gives are VCRs, which took off because people preferred watching porn in the privacy of their own homes, Polaroids and digital cameras were popular for couples who like, wanted to take photographs, but not have them be developed by strangers. Streaming was first video streaming was first developed by a Dutch porn company, Red Light District TM, and then 8% of internet commerce in 1993, which at that point was around $1.3 billion was spent on porn, making it the leading online industry. And I'm not advocating for anything, but I'm just saying that like these examples, I think speak to the potential direction, and certainly a more insidious direction of like all of this to go go in. And what we know is that like, a lot of culture and emerging trends, go to the bad rise from kind of like these fringe places, as well.

Clara

I was just gonna say like, even sort of, like zooming out slightly, I think, and this has been commented on many times before, especially sort of around Siri and Alexa, but how all of these kind of AI assistants are sort of feminized, like even Sydney like Harvey is the only one that I've heard so far. That's like, kind of male, which is law. So I mean, take that for what you will, but I think that there is just sort of like this weirdness to the way that like, and I don't know, like, again, I'm not necessarily placing this on the same spectrum as anything else. But like the idea that like, you would push Sydney, the robot to, like the brink of sanity, and like, create content around it. Like, I'm just sort of curious, I guess. And this is like, the 10 year 20 year question like how stuff like that ends up aging, because I think like, already, we're having conversations about robot ethics as like, robots are deployed in hospitals and in hotels, and they're often abused, like, I don't know, if you guys remember hitch bot was dismembered in Philadelphia. And, you know, that's like a very real question, as technology starts to sort of become, you know, more and more human seeming, the types of things that are allowed and the things that are like not allowed. And I think, to me, it's like an interesting, it's obviously not the most pressing question, but I think it is sort of like an important question, even outside of like, the sphere of like, adult entertainment, porn, etc, because it does have implications outside of that, that are not limited to like, robot ethics, if you happen not to care about return on ethics, but.

Trey

I just think that like, we are having that conversation, but probably very few people are having that conversation. And if the people who are in charge of creating these things are having it, they're probably not having it enough. Because in the experience and history of the world, people who create new technologies, Theranos, for example, are very...

Clara

Just to pick a random example.

Trey

Just to pick a random example. Or just, you know, wanting to push things forward, rather than like questioning the validity of this new technology being asked for desired needed, and the implications beyond its creation. But it was going to ask, have you guys heard of Shudu the first AI supermodel?

Clara

No, no, please share?

Eli

Is this like a little Miquela adjacent.

Trey

It's kind of like a little Miquela adjacent thing. But recently, Shudu was in the news, because she's already had two years of her career. So which is crazy, but she was based on a real life black model. And lo and behold, can you guess who created her and who is reaping the benefits financially from her work?

Clara

A white guy of some kind.

Trey

A white guy! So again, I just think it's like a good example of technology being used in a way that points to larger societal issues that need to be addressed. And again, it gets like really gray area, when you do talk about AI and AI working for you and AI working of a particular race for another particular race really starts to like, bust open the myriad issues that can come from not thinking things through properly. Yeah. Which, again, hopefully, Harvey is gonna work out for the law firm, but.

Clara

I know well, don't ask him any tough questions. Just keep it really basic for Harvey, he's a little slow.

Trey

My main question just generally is like, why are all these new AI tools being developed to replace creative jobs and creative work, or even like, make them more frictionless? I would want an AI to take care of the mundane tasks in my life. Like Harvey, for example, like read the law contracts, the terms and conditions, clean my bathtub if you want, but like, I want to do my own painting, drawing and like singing, not that I'm doing those things. But you know what? I mean? Why isn't AI being helping people come up with like better pickup lines or creating songs for you? Or creating like art and stuff? It's like, can't we tackle the boring stuff, the less glamorous stuff?

Clara

Well, I did get an IG story ad for like some sort of AI task robot. I'll have to find it and send it to you. But I agree. I mean, it is kind of maybe it's just the ones that happen to be the buzziest are like the kind of open AI ones that are sort of more creative and iterative. I don't know, because I didn't know about Harvey until my dad and then this Wired article like, I don't know, maybe there's other things like that that are in the works. But yeah, because it's kind of like this interesting pattern.

Eli

I mean, I think those will probably become the most like, prominent use cases. They're just like the most unsexy. Kinda like what Claire was saying,

Clara

Well, I think too, it's like and I'm no expert in AI. So anyone feel free to jump in here. But like, what is interesting too, with open AI versus something like Harvey like Harvey's knowledge base is like open law databases are Have like precedent and contracts. And like least formatting like Harvey isn't answering questions about like, how old was JFK when blah, blah, blah, you know. And so I think it's like, it is just less fun to use, except in that very specific use case. But I feel like, I'm also curious, and I don't know, maybe this is taking it into a separate space, but like..

Eli

Do you think that he'd be like, the grassy knoll was a concept conceived by the CIA?

Clara

Yeah, well, they could you ever and this is like, I guess a be a question for both of you. But, you know, like, basically, they created Harvey, this law firm created Harvey to be their AI assistant, and like, this whole sort of proprietary AI bot, that you can feed it in the information that you want it to be able to sort of work within, like, if, you know, dare I say, if we wanted an AI bot to sort of like be aware of every campaign that everyone a can lion to be aware of, like, every sort of like most recent spec, best performing practice, everything on every social platform, you know, basically to just like run ideas by or pressure test things with is that may be a viable future of like, getting these much more specific bots to do a much more specific type of Harvey esque job. Or maybe even like, people get to build their own, like, I can have my Clara bot, or whatever her name will be.

Eli

What would her name be?

Clara

Her name would be Clara bot. Obviously, I'm not changing, you know, she just, you know, it's like extension. I don't I wouldn't rename it you know,

Eli

I guess if it ain't broke, don't fix it. I think that is right. I think for like, entertainment companies or say like, Ubisoft or EA, or I don't know, Marvel Cinematic Universe, like giving their fans the opportunity to like create, using their own IP, or something like that. That's like the glamorous version. But I think there is going to be like a tax bot and like, someone who's going to look over your lease, and they're going to be made by like, the real estate management company.

Clara

But no, but that's what I'm saying, though, is like, I want my own one, you know, because I think like to your point, Trey, like the state of modern life at this point is like, I respond to emails all day I answer was like, random texts for my landlord. I have to figure out the lease, I have to figure out the rental agreement. It's like, if I could just be like, you talk to the bot, the bot will figure it out. Like, are we getting screwed in this lease bot like any of that type of thing? I feel like that outsourcing. Surely there's a market to like, send people to just talk to your bot for things that are non essential. Like why do I need to go 18 rounds.

Eli

Reply bot. Reply bot on email? Hey, Trey, Trey is not available right now.

Trey

Yeah, at what point though are we just all interacting via AI generated problems that like no one's actually interacting with each other? It's not real life anymore?

Eli

Yeah, we don't speak.

Trey

My bot goes to the social function I just don't want to go to

Eli

That's a true, that's a real life NPC.

Clara

It's like the Westworld crossover.

Trey

Those are all like, like you mentioned the viable options. And the way that I imagine AI will go in some senses. But there's no way that these VCs are going to fund things that aren't the risky, ethically questionable use cases of AI. Do you know what I mean? Like the ones that will get the most funding and the most money and the most headlines will be the ones that we can discuss and break down at nauseam? Because they are huge risks, you know?

Eli

Yeah. All right. Well, that's a perfect segue because I want to close it close this out with one prediction from each of you as to where we're headed. With this, it can be about relationship AI's, it can be about Harvey's day in court, it can be about whatever.

Trey

I'm gonna go, I'm gonna go for a positive one here.

Eli

Good, because I wasn't, alright go for it.

Trey

And it's going to be so first of all, I do think there will be a huge increase in misinformation, based on people just like not knowing how to use these tools properly and cite their sources properly. But that said, there are a lot of AI tools being built and released. Currently, one there's called Paper brain where you can research a lot of University published research papers and studies. So in that sense, it's like cracking the door open to give you access to all this like publicly vetted information by actual professionals in their own industries. And I do hope that like, kind of, like I said, opens the door for a lot of people to begin to learn how to like, question things and cite their sources and spread that information that probably exists already, but it's buried under like lock and key in some university library to the wider public, which I think is hopeful.

Eli

Nice, Clara?

Clara

No you can go next, I'm still thinking about my prediction.

Eli

I think that Sam Altman will become the new kind of like tech or like, Flashpoint person in tech. And I think Sam Altman, for those who are listening as the kind of like founder, or one of the founders of Open AI, which is the kind of like preeminent large language model ChatGBT, etc, I bet that he will have to testify in front of a very, very painful congressional hearing in which none of the people in Congress will really understand what they're saying. And he'll have to kind of like, explain it to them, which sounds really boring. But I also think that's how they get out of like, every type of regulation whatsoever, because they move way faster than that any George Santos or whatever can catch up with them. All right, Clara. I hope that was runway enough for you to close this now.

Clara

No, I was just going to be like, how might we get Gen Z excited about congressional hearings? Like I don't know Eli. But, um, no, I mean, I guess I have a slightly positive one, I think. I think that right now, it's a scary time. And there's a lot of open frontier. And there's a lot of questions of like, every type and flavor and as there should be, but I do think and maybe this is optimistic, whatever. But I think that like with new technologies, we do ultimately find some type of center balance, even if it's like, you know, where it's not 100%. Right, or it's not 100% where we want it to be. I think that we will get to that point faster than we think we will. And I think that like we'll have more of those answers. It will be a painful learning process. But I don't think that like even just as quickly as it's been adopted in the past, like, how long have we been talking about this three months, like, it will be a very short period of time before like, this all feels very antiquated and alarmist, for better and worse, you know.

Eli

Thank you, Clara.

Trey

Or we'll be proven right all along

Clara

Or we will be proven right all along and Trey bot and Clara bot and Eli bot will now host Day One FM signing off forever. Bye!

Eli

On that note, thanks for tuning in! Thanks for listening in. Be sure to check out more on d1a.com/perspectives, and sign up for our bi-weekly newsletter to get the latest trends and insights directly to your mailbox.